68: Does Depression Lead to Bad Food Choices? | Josh Noland

68: Does Depression Lead to Bad Food Choices? | Josh Noland

Intro:

Michael Kummer: What do you think is more true, that eating the wrong types of foods makes you depressed, or depression makes you choose the wrong types of food? 

Josh Noland: In 2019, you know, I was walking up my steps to my house, and it's only a few steps, but I was out of breath. and I knew that I needed to change. 

Michael Kummer: And so you can continue being more productive.

Um, your mood is, is more stable and a lot of, a lot of other benefits by just going for a walk after you had carbohydrates. 

Josh Noland: And doing that was another, uh, boost to my, my ego and my motivation. 

Michael Kummer: Are you ready to revolutionize your health and reconnect to your primal self? Welcome to the Primal Shift Podcast.

Sponsorship:

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And now back to the episode.

Michael Kummer: Hey Josh. Uh, thanks so much for jumping on this call with me.

We met at Hack Your Health just a couple of months ago. And, uh, we started talking and you showed me your new book and, uh, I was really intrigued about your book. your story, um, on, on how you became a, I guess, an influencer and advocate for, for living healthier, for improving your health. And, you know, you dealt with a couple of issues in the past that you overcame by making lifestyle choices.

And we're going to talk about more about your book and, and all of the things, but that you do. Um, But first, I'd like to ask you a question, um, and you know, you just let me know whatever first pops into your head. What is, what do you think is more true, that eating the wrong types of foods makes you depressed, or depression makes you choose the wrong types of food?

Josh Noland: Wow, Michael, that is a great question. Um, it really goes both ways. But if I had to choose, I think mental health, uh, is really the, the base. Um, what makes you decide to eat the foods that you eat? Um, but also what you eat affects your, your mental health as well. So it's really a catch 22. 

Michael Kummer: Yeah. And, and I'm asking this, you know, because I, there are a lot of people that I've met who try and, and also do.

The right things, you know, they exercise, they try to sleep well, they eat well. Um, and yet after a while they kind of fall back into their old habits and and then just this morning I I reviewed a an episode. I recorded with someone else a couple of weeks ago and uh, Daniel, uh team was her name and and she said that she she's had the same experience and If, if there is something going on, you know, based on trauma, based on past experiences that doesn't necessarily put you in a good spot from a mental health perspective, you're much more likely to fall back into your old habits and either derail, uh, everything you've accomplished or, you know, not see the results that you want in terms of weight loss, in terms of, you know, everything that, you know, goes along with, with, with being healthy and wellness.

Right. And so is that also something that, how did you. Over. I mean, you, you know, you said you had, you know, you were depressed, you know? Yeah. And now you're not. Mm-Hmm. what changed and, and what kind of, you know, obstacles did you come across as part of your healing journey? 

Josh Noland: Yeah, there's definitely a lot to unpack there.

Um, , you know, I've struggled with depression my whole life. And in, in 2019, um, you know, I was walking up my steps to my house and it's, it's only a few steps, but I was out of breath. And I knew that I needed to change. And, um, that's when I started speaking with a therapist and they recommended, uh, meditation.

And, you know, I never thought that I would, um, be the type of person to meditate, but I, you know, I was sick and tired of being sick and tired and I was open to new things. So I tried it out and it, it really helped. It really helped me feel good. It helped me feel like I could deal with more, uh, stuff throughout the day.

And it, it just made me feel proud of myself that I, you know, sat down and, and accomplished something. Um, I also started working out and, uh, doing, um, strength training a few days a week. And doing that was another, uh, boost to my, my ego and my motivation. You know, the endorphins that are released when you're exercising really help you feel good.

And so, you know, just sticking with those two things and being consistent, the, the nutrition aspect is really important too. I mean, we're, you know, social creatures and we like to eat together and, you know, going out to restaurants or going out drinking. It's, you know, such a big part of people's lives, but if you really want to take your health into your own hands, you really have to prioritize your health.

How do you do 

Michael Kummer: that? Especially if you're not in a good spot mentally, 

Josh Noland: you know, one key that I use to help me was replacing candy and chips, um, at night, eating those things at night with, with fruit. Um, You know, eating fruit is, it's way better than, than processed junk foods. And it might be high in sugar, but it's still, it's got the fiber.

It's got all the other nutrients in it. And with the, um, you know, the knee surgery that I had, it was a real struggle because the recovery was a few months before I could get back to working out, but I did what I could. I did, you know, upper body workouts. And I, you know, just tried to walk, um, once I was cleared from the doctor to start walking again, I would just walk.

And, um, you know, walking is a really, really critical health, um, tool that, that people I don't think use as much. I mean, even just going for a short walk after every meal can help with digestion, can help with your mood. You're getting that sun, you're getting that fresh air, you're in nature, and just, you know, gives you time to think about stuff.

Michael Kummer: There are two things I want to get back to, but one thing regarding the walking, especially after a meal, especially after consuming carbohydrates. I've noticed a significant improvement over how my body responds to carbohydrates, especially simple carbohydrates, like from fruit or whatever the case might be, if I go for a walk.

Um, so it, it blunts my blood sugar response dramatically. And the advantage of that is, you know, ignoring, you know, all the long term health benefits of not having, you know, your blood sugar spike, you know, like crazy all the time, but you have less of a drop. And if you have less of a drop, that means you feel less crappy, you know, one and a half hours later after you had that, you know, carb rich meal, right?

And so you're more exactly the crash. And so you can continue being more productive. Um, your mood is, is more stable and a lot of, a lot of other benefits by just going for a walk after you had carbohydrates. Um, it's so simple, right? And the second thing that I, um, that you mentioned is, you know, make those, you know, replace candy with fruit.

You know, it's, it's something so simple, right? But it's meaningful In the greater scheme of things, because for the brain, I think it's a, it's a success. If you manage to say, you know what, no Snickers bar, I'm going to have an apple or a banana or blueberries or what have you. It's a mental win, right? And you get addicted to those wins.

And by being addicted to your own wins, you are more likely to make better choices because you want to get the reward, right? That you would otherwise get, I guess, from, you know, The Snickers bar, but now you get it in a different way. It's equally rewarding, but significantly better for your body. And I think that's what those meaningful small changes, um, is if I'm hearing you correctly, is one of the key, uh, factors in, in having success longterm instead of trying to.

Going from a standard American diet to a carnivore diet overnight and then you fail two weeks in because you just can't do it, right? Yeah, it might be better to take those depending on the type of personality, of course But if you're already mentally in a bad spot Then doing something incredibly challenging that has a high risk of failure might not be the best approach 

Josh Noland: I definitely agree with that.

I recommend making small changes to You know, start with one thing, very small, stick with it for a little bit and just slowly start adding on more things over time to help you develop habits that will serve your health, not hurt your health. And um, you know, I, I promote prioritizing protein. Uh, my, my book is called Living the Protein Lifestyle.

And so with, with that in mind, just making those small changes, you know, add one extra egg. to your breakfast or add an extra hamburger patty to your hamburger and skip the fries and the soda. Right. Those kind of small changes really add up over time. 

Michael Kummer: Yeah. Yeah. I totally agree. What's so special about protein?

Josh Noland: Protein. It's the building block of every cell in your body and it promotes health, helps you build muscle and, um, and it can help with your, your mental health too. Um, It's, it's just so critical and so many people are, are under consuming protein, whether it's, you know, animal proteins, which I recommend, or, or plant proteins, just all protein in general people aren't getting enough.

They're eating too much carbs, and they're not eating enough fat either. Uh, people forget that, you know, there's essential fats, and there aren't any essential, uh, carbs. 

Michael Kummer: Right, right. That's the only macronutrient that you don't really need to, to survive. Some might argue, you know, if depending on, you know, your physical activity and stuff, there are benefits to consuming carbs, right?

But you're certainly not going to die if you don't eat them. Whereas if you stop eating protein or stop eating fat, you will die. 

Josh Noland: Yeah. There's people that have been on the carnivore diet for 10 or 20 years and they're perfectly healthy. Um, but there's other people that can't do that and they need carbs and right.

As long as you're getting it from Whole Foods, I think that's totally okay. As long as you're prioritizing that protein first. 

Michael Kummer: Right, right. And, you know, I've, I've made, I've had the experience that if I prioritize protein with every meal, I'm significantly less likely to eat something that I shouldn't.

Because I don't have enough room in my stomach for something else. You know, if I eat, you know, a pound of meat, let's say there is very little that I have room for that could potentially derail, you know, my otherwise somewhat solid diet, you know? And it's a very easy fix because you're not having to. to make a choice not to have something you just don't feel like eating more because you're full, right?

By just consuming enough protein and especially if, if paired with fat, um, you know, both are very satiating, um, and make it significantly less likely to do something stupid. Definitely. So when you had your knee surgery, obviously couldn't work out, you said, right? Um, how did you manage to stay in shape or not gain weight?

Because a lot of people think that, Oh, if, if I cannot work out every single day, then I'm going to gain weight. That might not necessarily be true. Right. Um, what is, what is your take on that? 

Josh Noland: Um, I mean, exercise is critical, moving, getting your steps in every day. And, you know, you only need to do strength training a few times a week, maybe three days a week.

Um, you know, getting some mobility in there like two days a week is important too. And, and cardio is, is important. Um, not as important as I think people may have thought more in the past. Um, especially for weight loss, but, but yeah, I mean, if you're limited, if you are recovering from a surgery or an injury, You just gotta find something to, to keep moving and stay active.

Um, you know, I, I had some resistance bands that I would use, um, to do upper body, uh, exercises when I was still recovering from my knee injury. And then as my, my knee healed, I would use those, uh, bands, the lighter ones on my legs to start. strengthening those muscles again and just doing whatever you can.

Just finding a few minutes a day, even if it's not all at one time, even if it's one minute here, one minute there, that all adds up. And it's, it's so important for your, your mental and physical health. 

Michael Kummer: Right. You mentioned resistance bands. I actually just started, uh, experimenting with, uh, with resistance bands, uh, training because it literally takes you a couple of minutes, depending on, you know, what, what protocol you follow, you can do it from anywhere.

You don't need a lot of space. It's fairly inexpensive, comparatively speaking. Um, and that's your resistance training. And some argue. It's significantly better than lifting traditional weights, you know, from a, you know, risk injury perspective from a, you know, muscle building perspective. Um, and so there is a lot to be said about something as simple as a couple of resistance bands, you know?

Mm hmm. 

Josh Noland: Yeah, definitely. I, um, went on a road trip, uh, last summer. And I didn't know what I was going to do as far as my, my exercises. And so I bought a couple of resistance bands and I got a program and there's, there's different kinds of resistance bands. There's kind of those wider, um, tubular ones. And then there's like longer ones that, that you can use for, for all kinds of different stuff.

And they're, they're so great, like you said, for traveling. Uh, wherever you are, you can take them. I mean, a lot of people have a hangup about going to a gym. You know, it's intimidating. It's, um, you gotta take extra time out of your day and it's, it's not necessary for everyone. Uh, it has its place, but you can do stuff at home.

You can, you know, do body weight exercises or use resistance bands or, you know, just get creative and find heavy things to use at home or just a couple of dumbbells. 

Michael Kummer: Yeah. So. There are two things, two topics that I want to drill more into because I think they are, they're super important. And one is, you know, the, the whole mental health aspect of overall wellness, which I think is severely, um, underrated.

And there is also, I guess, a stigma to it. You know, if you see a therapist and that means you're crazy, but if you go to a regular doctor for, you know, every, you know, nobody would, would question you to say, Hey, I'm going to go to a doctor because I feel like something is not right. You know? Everything is fine.

But if you say, you know what, I don't really feel good. You know, I've not been feeling great lately. I want to go to a therapist, you know, to help me figure out what's going on. It's like, Hmm, you know, that guy is crazy, you know? And so what, what is your, what is your take in terms of the, Should everyone be having a, or seeing a therapist?

Do you think that should be part of everyone's tool belt to have access to someone to, to talk to, to discuss? And, and I'm saying this with a, because we, usually people think, you know, I, I'm fine. You know, both from a mental as well as physical health perspective, right? Unless something is seriously wrong, everyone is fine.

Even though they are not. I thought that I was meant, uh, physically fine for most of my life until I realized that Nothing was fine, you know I just thought it was normal to feel a certain way and the same goes with you know, mental health health aspects I mean just looking back at you know, childhood at you know Previous generations how our parents and their parents, you know grew up what they endured, you know, be it the war or something else Everyone has trauma.

Everyone has baggage. Everyone has something You know That is negatively influencing how they respond, you know, either, you know, raising the kids or making food choices, making whatever. There is so much influence in, in, in our past experiences and nobody seems to be realizing that. What is your kind of your take on that?

And what should, what should everyone be doing, you know, to kind of, A, understand and B, maybe fix some of those issues. 

Josh Noland: Yeah. Yeah. I argue that that mental health is the most important aspect of overall health. And I, I do think everyone should be talking to a therapist, even if you don't have really big issues and you don't feel like you need to, I think it's really important for everyone to have.

Um, someone to talk to that's unbiased and trained in, you know, mental health and that can help you work through things. You know, in the past, I think mental health, like you were saying, is more not talked about and people just kind of dealt with whatever they're, you know, struggling with, especially men.

Um, you kinda used to have to be tough and it wasn't really acceptable to talk about how you're feeling. And, and it's really, You know, now it's becoming more socially acceptable and it's, it's just so critical. Um, if you're not motivated to take care of yourself, you're not going to work out. You're not going to make the right food choices.

So there's, there's a few things you can do besides speaking with a, you know, mental health professional. I know some people can have, um, you know, financial limitations or just, um, availability, or they might not want to talk to someone. but even just something as simple as having a gratitude practice where you sit down and take a few minutes and just either think about it or keep a gratitude journal and just think about what you're grateful for and what you have, you know, your, your, uh, physical, um, your physical abilities, people that you have in your life and you know, where you are, just thinking about those things can really help you.

Uh, have a more optimistic look on life and think of, you know, what if I could do this versus what if I can't? 

Michael Kummer: Yeah, that was a, I don't know where my wife read it, but a while ago she said, you know, whenever we think like I can't, you know, switch that in your head to how can I? Something is what, what, what has really worked well for me is if I'm overwhelmed and I go, you know, I take off my shirt, go to the backyard, I just sit on the grass, you know, I get my, my grounding, you know, I'm just in, in contact with the, my skin is in contact with the soil.

I just sit there, I close my eyes and I, I focus on how it, how the sunshine feels on my skin, especially in summer when you can really feel the sun like piercing into your skin, you can really feel the energy being transmitted and just being present and feeling that, you know, listening to the birds, listening to what's going on around you.

That's just nothing more than being present in the moment, instead of thinking of, you know, all what I have to do next or tomorrow, or what did I do yesterday wrong or what have you just being present and doing that for just a couple of minutes, you know, I get up and I feel better regardless of how I felt before.

Right. Um, and, and it's free there. You don't need anything. You don't need to pay anyone. All you have to do is take off your shirt and your shoes and find a patch of grass. 

Josh Noland: Yeah. It only takes a few minutes and it makes such a big difference. 

Michael Kummer: Yeah. Um, the second thing I want to, um, since I know that you're, you're working on a cookbook, right?

Yes. Food preparation. Why is that important? 

Josh Noland: When you cook at home, you can, you can serve yourself the right ratios of, of the macronutrients. You know, when you eat out, they usually don't give you enough protein and they usually give you way too many carbs. So when you're cooking for yourself, you can decide how much of those macros you get It's really hard to find quality food when you're eating on the go.

Michael Kummer: And the one thing, you know, nobody, usually nobody else cares about your health as much as you should care about your health, right? If you go to a restaurant, you cannot expect the cook there or the chef there or the restaurant owner to care about your health, you know, they usually don't, you know, and so just assuming they do, I think is already a recipe, pun intended for disaster, 

Josh Noland: right?

There's a few, few restaurants that, that are, you know, health focused and, and use good ingredients. But for the majority of them, they're using the cheapest ingredients possible so they can make the most profit. And, um, you know, those, those ultra processed oils are a really big factor in, in people's health these days.

They're using these oils for, for deep frying, for, um, sauteing, for everything. And, and there's so, um, inflammatory in your body. it really causes a lot of damage and a lot of problems. So if you can, you know, just cook yourself as much as you can. And when you go out, try to limit, um, these, these bad foods when you can, by, you know, making good choices, um, trying to order just, you know, a side of steak or some hamburger patties, um, you know, try to skip the fries and.

You can even ask them if they can prepare your food with, with butter. Um, you know, that's helpful too. 

Michael Kummer: Yeah, we always do that. And even, you know, sometimes like yesterday, actually, um, we, we ordered some, uh, some food from, uh, from a, from a local restaurant here and instead of letting them, you know, choose the container.

that they would put the food in, which is usually plastic or some, or aluminum, you know, we, we said, you know what, we're going to bring our own glass containers, please put the food in there and we'll take it home that way, you know, because heat and plastic, obviously. Not a good thing, and those plastic containers they use in the restaurants, those are not, you know, the highest quality, you know, plastic containers that are less likely to leach endocrine disrupting chemicals into the food, those are the cheapest ones, obviously, because they're throwaway, you know, containers, and you can be sure as hell that by the time you get home, you know, you have estrogen in that food.

Josh Noland: Right, yeah, all the foods, um, at restaurants are, are packaged in plastic, and they're all pre made, And they're basically just reheating these foods. And, and there's so many problems, um, with all that, you know, when you're on the road, it's hard. Um, it's easy to go to most fast food places and just, just get a hamburger patty and, uh, or a couple and just eat those to, to get you by.

Michael Kummer: Yeah, I remember several years ago, we went to Costa Rica or we were in Costa Rica. And on the way home from the beach, it was like a five hour car drive or something. You know, we got hungry and we just drove to McDonald's and, you know, ordered, you know, eight, uh, patties, beef patties. Um, and that was it, you know, and yeah, I don't know exactly what's in there, but it's definitely better than, um, Then having the, you know, the hamburger, basically the entire thing, the bread and, and, and the seed oil sauces and everything.

Um, and I mean, that was. I think, I don't know, five, six years ago, probably these days I would choose to fast rather than eat a McDonald's patty. Uh, but nevertheless, you know, it's, it would, it was definitely the better choice than we could have made otherwise. And doing better, I think, do something better than, you know, you did yesterday, I think is always a good strategy because if you keep doing that at some point, you're going to, you're going to end up where, you know, the choice is no longer bad.

It's, it's mostly good. And, um, and, and, and that's certainly would put you on, on the right path rather than making the same poor choices over and over again. All right. Um, so there is one book you already published. You actually got me a copy. I have it in my shelf behind me. There is another one you're working on the cookbook, right?

Uh, where can people find those, those books and more about you if they want to learn? Uh, and what else, what is next for you besides, you know, writing those books, publishing those books, what are you up to? 

Josh Noland: Yeah, well, so I published, um, Living the Protein Lifestyle, uh, last December, and that's the one that, um, that you read, and that's, uh, the story of my journey, my health evolution, I like to call it, um, and it includes the strategies and methods that I use to find lasting success.

Um, I lost over 70 pounds, um, you know, and I had that knee surgery and I lost a job, um, but I was still able to stick with my, my healthy habits and, and, you know, I feel great. I feel better than I ever have before. I just turned 40. And, um, then just this past May, I published a workbook 

Michael Kummer: to go 

Josh Noland: along, um, with the book.

It's a step by step guide. to help you, uh, launch your health evolution. And it has, uh, a lot of the same information in the book, uh, my first book, but it includes, um, self assessments and action steps and a ton of resources for every topic to help people, uh, get into these different areas of health and, and start working on themselves.

And the cookbook, the protein lifestyle cookbook is going to be coming out in December. And that is filled with all the recipes that I've used over the years, uh, to find success, uh, high protein, low carb recipes that are easy to make. So I'm busy recipe testing and, um, you know, writing out the recipes and I'm very excited to share those with everyone.

Um, but, um, In between all that, I just published, um, another book on irritable bowel syndrome. All right. That's this book right here. 

Michael Kummer: Uh, 

Josh Noland: one in five people are struggling with digestive issues these days, and it's, it's all about the food. I started writing this book because two of my family members were struggling with, uh, irritable bowel.

And I just, I wanted to be able to help them. You know, everything in the other two books, it's all the same stuff. Yeah, it's all about nutrition and fitness and mental health. And so I, I wrote this book geared towards, you know, IBS and, and I hope I can help as many people as I can. Um, but all of my books are, are available on Amazon.

Um, alright. I've got include the links, paperback. Yeah, I got audiobooks, eBooks, so you can get the information, whatever format suits you. Um. And then I've got a ton of free resources, including my top three high protein, easy to make recipes on my website, joshnoland. com. That's J O S H N O L A N D. com. So if you want to learn more or get some free resources, uh, check it out.

Michael Kummer: All right, right on. I'm looking forward to that cookbook because, you know, a lot of people, I think, struggle if they. start on a particular diet. And especially if it's a diet that's, I guess, that they would consider restrictive compared to the standard American diet where everything goes, right? A lot of people, you know, get, get bored of, you know, of eating only meat or eating only low carb or whatever the case might be, but you know, food doesn't have to be boring.

Or food can be healthy and, and, and exciting and delicious at the same time, if you know what you're doing, right? If you know how to use the tools at your disposal. And so a good cookbook, especially at my, you know, my wife is the one cooking most of the time. And so I've, I've, I noticed that the more, um, The more input you get in terms of different recipes, in terms of how to make, you know, something very simple, very exciting looking or exciting tasting, the easier it is to stick to it and to easier it is than to convince the rest of your family who might not be on board, you know, with your newly found, you know, desire to be healthier, you know, to come on board and, and join you and support you.

And so I think that's, uh, cookbook is always, uh, um, something, uh, very useful to have in your, in your tool belt. 

Josh Noland: Having a variety of different recipes at your disposal really comes in handy too. You know, I tried, uh, the carnivore diet in January and it was really hard. I got really bored really quick with just eating steak and ground beef.

And so, You know, I dug into my recipes and I found other ways to spice it up a little bit and make it more interesting, you know, make it a little different and get some variety. And, um, yeah, that's, that's what you have to do. Just keep it interesting and look at new recipes, get excited about trying different things.

And as long as you stick with it, you're gonna feel good. You're gonna be happy. 

Michael Kummer: Right on. Well, thanks so much for, uh, for making the time for joining me on the podcast. A lot of good information looking forward. I'm going to link all the books obviously down below. Uh, I read the one, you know, the protein diet book.

Uh, it was very much, I told you that before on, on the same page as, you know, we are, we are on here and, uh, with the Kummer family and how we eat, how we live, how we, prioritize certain things over others. Um, and so I think it's a really good guideline and, and it's flexible enough at the same time. I think that's very important.

You know, it's not very, it's not as restrictive as a lot of people think. In fact, you know, I don't think it's restrictive at all, but obviously if you come from a standard American diet and a standard American lifestyle, everything else appears to be restrictive. But once you get your head around that, um, and get used to making better choices, you'll find that there is a lot of wiggle room.

To make your lifestyle, your lifestyle, and you know, make it work for you depending on, or regardless of what circumstances you're in. Yeah. All right. Cool. Thanks man. Thank you so much for having me Michael. I really 

Josh Noland: appreciate it. Yeah. 

Michael Kummer: Same here. And, uh, I will let you know once the episode goes live.

Sounds good. Take care. All right. Thanks man. Bye. 

Extra: Next on the Primal Shift Podcast. Get ready for a deep dive into the truth behind your dog's diet. Why are dogs natural born meat eaters, and what are the misconceptions even your vet might be pushing? In this upcoming episode, we'll explore canine ancestry, physiology, and our personal experience feeding a raw meat diet to Rib Eye, our German Shepherd.

Learn how this diet contrasts with the common kibble most dogs are on today, and why it could be harming your pet. Get ready to challenge the status quo and rethink what's really best for your four legged friend. Tune in.